You did say that, or rather implied it. You claimed this person must know every single cop, but you just admitted right now that actually you don't need to know every single cop to prove that all cops commit crimes. Because covering up for someone else is also a crime, and all cops presumably cover up. Arguably, just the simple act of existing as a cop is perpetuating injustice of the system.
So it's sort of self proving, or proven by definition. By definition of what cops are and what they are allowed to do, all cops must be bastards. If they weren't, they wouldn't be cops!
> you just admitted right now that actually you don't need to know every single cop to prove that all cops commit crimes. Because covering up for someone else is also a crime, and all cops presumably cover up. Arguably, just the simple act of existing as a cop is perpetuating injustice of the system.
???
No, that is not a logical at all. Nor did I admit that. Please stop. You keep assuming things that are not true about what I've clearly written.
Yes, you did admit that, by implication. To replay what exactly happened in this conversation.
Person A: It's almost not worth commenting on the irony of someone using the name "rationalist" failing to understand basic concepts like "covering up a crime is also a crime".
Reduced: "you do not understand that covering up a crime is also a crime".
You: I did not say or imply that.
Implication: I do understand that covering up a crime is also a crime, and do not imply otherwise.
Implication: since covering up a crime is also a crime, you admit that you do not need to prove every cop has committed a crime themselves to be a criminal.
I'm not assuming anything, I'm only taking your words at face value. What's happening is you're writing things without using your brain to think about what you're writing. So, if what I'm saying sounds stupid or obvious... uh, okay, reflect on that.
Regardless, you're missing the forest for the trees here. You didn't bother to actually reply to anything I said, probably because you thought this sad little response would be easier.
The ACAB viewpoint comes from the preposition that policing in the US is systemicly or institutionally broken and fueled by injustice. Thereby, any willing participation in it is, by definition, an act of injustice.
It's sort of how all jesters are silly. To be a jester, you must be silly, so by definition of a jester all jesters are silly.
Sorry, I rarely look at usernames and assumed you were the same person as earlier.
> Implication: I do understand that covering up a crime is also a crime, and do not imply otherwise.
> Implication: since covering up a crime is also a crime, you admit that you do not need to prove every cop has committed a crime themselves to be a criminal.
The first implication is reasonable. It also assumes facts not in evidence, however I will say this: I do understand that covering up a crime is criminal in places where I am familiar with the law. I am not familiar with laws everywhere. I will also say this: a cop covering up a crime of another cop is bad, thus that person would be considered a bad cop. I think we can both agree on that last statement.
The second implication is a bad take. That assumes that all cops are covering up crimes. I posit that not every cop has done that, but an unknown percentage somewhere better 0 and 100, have.
> I'm not assuming anything, I'm only taking your words at face value.
Based on your second implication, I believe that statement to be incorrect.
> What's happening is you're writing things without using your brain to think about what you're writing.
I would say that is more applicable to you.
> You didn't bother to actually reply to anything I said, probably because you thought this sad little response would be easier.
Please reread the HN Guidelines.
> policing in the US is systemicly or institutionally broken and fueled by injustice
I am open to agreeing with this, because some percentage greater than 0 but less than 100, is.
> Thereby, any willing participation in it is, by definition, an act of injustice.
Again, no, please stop. Somewhere your thought process is broken. You do not appear to have a strong concept of causal relationships.
It is impossible to have a reasonable argument with a person who cannot reason, therefore I will not continue this discussion with you (with someone else, sure).
If the system itself is set up such that it covers up the crimes of cops, which I would argue it is, then yes - simply by knowing that information and choosing to participate in the system, you have just helped cover up crimes, which is a crime.
Consider: is it possible to be an ethical member of the mafia?
> Somewhere your thought process is broken. You do not appear to have a strong concept of causal relationships.
I don't think you even believe this is true, you're just short circuiting like a poorly built robot. You can't respond to what I'm actually saying so it's just "uhhh uhhh you're not logical! I can't respond to illogical people!"
But think about it, for like longer than 5 seconds. If you know the police do bad things, and you want to join anyway, doesn't that mean that you must want to do bad things? And, if you're in the forced, doesn't that mean that you're helping and abetting said bad things?
If your brain really can't comprehend why that doesn't compute, then okay remove the world police. Replace it with mafia, or pirates, or gang, or Nazis. The concept itself makes sense, no?
I think the problem is that you intrinsicly view the police as good guys, they fight crime. But that's not really true, one because good guys and bad guys don't exist, that's comic book stuff, but also because the police are systemicly, institutionally, evil. Like, from their conception as slave catchers in the south.
You might view the police as good guys who sometimes do bad things. Others view them as essentially a gang. Except a state-sponsored gang, which is much much worse.
In that light, do you understand how ACAB might come to be? Even if you don't agree with it?
> do you understand how ACAB might come to be? Even if you don't agree with it?
Yes, the same way that some people hate all people of a skin color based on bad experiences with a few people of that skin color, and reports from other people of bad experiences with a few other people of that akin color.
Or if you would like an example of a characteristic that people can choose rather than being born with:
I just missed the edit window in my parent comment.
If the premise of "acab" is that good cops are complicit by turning a blind eye to the bad cops, then by that reasoning, good members of other communities are complicit by turning a blind eye to the bad people who share the same characteristics.
I refuse to judge people based on the color of their skin, their chosen religion, or their chosen job based on the actions of others.
The cops arent a “grass roots community of random individuals who all randomly share characteristics” they’re an organized, funded, and trained to have those characteristics. You seem to have some incorrect idea of how police organize and operate as compared to left-handed people or people going to the park on Saturday.
The only outlandish claim is everything you're stating. Police corruption and it's effects is a well documented issue, pretending like it's unfair that someone calls cops basterds and telling people to be nicer to cops is ignoring the issue. It is unfair when a cop acts as judge jury and executioner and then gets away with those murders as protected by the legal system. That's the kind of unfairness being reflected back to the system from society onto the system through ACAB. No cop cares how "nice" a person they're interacting with is, no person cares about how nice a cop is.
False. Again you are assuming things. A lot of problems in life come from people assuming things that aren't true. Please, just stop, you're doing a disservice to the world with your ideology.
Yes, being a cop is like being black, you got it exactly right. You should write a book, or something, so the whole world can hear how unbelievably fucking stupid you sound.
Im not going to even try to argue further once we've reached the "I don't see color" part of the argument. I don't think there's anything I, or anyone, could say to you to make you believe that willing participants in corrupt systems might be accountable.
But, I leave you with a thought exercise: why are these statements different?
- all mobsters are bastards
- all gangsters are bastards
- all Nazis are bastards
- all cops are bastards
Surely you must agree with 1, or all three, of the preceding statements? Or, do you think that calling all skinheads bastards is prejudice akin to racism?
> - all mobsters are bastards - all gangsters are bastards - all Nazis are bastards - all cops are bastards
No, No, Yes, No
Only one of those was trying to promote a "master race"
(Especially since I have empathy for those forced into gangs. Maybe you shouldn't be an arbitrator and act like the judge, jury, and executioner, for things you do not understand.)
> willing participants in corrupt systems might be accountable.
You're choosing to take part in Ycombinator's platform. Ycombinator that has funded corrupt businesses.
By your reasoning, you are admitting that you are a bastard.
> the whole world can hear how unbelievably fucking stupid you sound.
I think your world view is skewed. I'm pretty sure the majority of the world sees that it is your arguments that are stupid. Maybe try and step outside of your echo chamber.
It's pretty clear at this point, that a discussion here is not going to change either of our minds, and it doesn't help when you wait several days to try and post a "gotcha", I'm not going to waste either of our times by continuing this.
