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Sublime Text 2 Web Inspector (sokolovstas.github.com)
282 points by DanielRibeiro on March 17, 2013 | hide | past | favorite | 96 comments



That looks very interesting, but typing several lines of text rather than speaking them is painful to sit through. I would suggest turning off the music next time and just tell people what it is and how it works.


Or skip the screencast altogether and just write step-by-step instructions.


At least mention what the default hotkeys are, and what will/should happen when you hit them. On Linux, after hitting CTRL+SHIFT+R, I just get the option to launch Chrome. I come back and hit CTRL+SHIFT+R again, and it's the same option.


I am having the same issue, have you figured out how to solve it?


Have you tried shutting down chrome before launching it from this plugin?


I don't think english is his native language… At least there was a screencast showing off the features


From the demo code: $scope.Russia = true

I'm guessing Russian


Yap you right, but this is geographic variable :)


Hey do you know why it isnt working on linux?

"On Linux, after hitting CTRL+SHIFT+R, I just get the option to launch Chrome. I come back and hit CTRL+SHIFT+R again, and it's the same option"

and the console shows: Created new window in existing browser session. [Finished in 0.4s]


I actually like the typing - I can watch the video without having to turn sound on. (the reason why I hate screencasts normally). Makes it much easier to watch on the train or during a lecture.

If only the typing was a bit faster, it would be perfect.


I liked the video presentation and the music. Thought it was quite nice. Thought what was going on was very clear.


Not to take away from the package, but I'm somewhat surprised that someone who invested significant work into this is running an unregistered version of ST.


why are you surprised by this? we don't all have $70 lying around


I'm surprised because someone who has committed this much time to developing an extension is arguably beyond the evaluation phase.

> Sublime Text 2 may be downloaded and evaluated for free, however a license must be purchased for continued use.


perhaps. perhaps not. for all we know, writing this package may be the author's way of evaluating the extensibility of the editor.

while we're at it, sublime text is far from the most popular python development tool. only the author knows which one was used. hell, they may even have paid for the one they used to develop this package.

why should a purchasing a license be a prerequisite to developing a sublime text package at all?


Surely if you read that you read the following sentence: "There is currently no enforced time limit for the evaluation."


Good point. I guess I'm not in a position to judge if this is still evaluation or not.


By writing the extension this person has clearly added way more than 70 dollars of value to st


I don't disagree with you, but that's not really the terms of the license.


Which specific terms of the license[1] lead you to conclude that the author has an obligation to pay $70?

[1] LICENSES

SUBLIME TEXT is licensed as follows:

Installation and Usage.

Licenses are per user and valid for use on all supported operating systems. License keys may be used on multiple computers and operating systems, provided the license key holder is the primary user. Businesses must purchase at least as many licenses as the number of people using SUBLIME TEXT. Backup Copies.

You may make copies of the license key and or SUBLIME TEXT for backup and archival purposes.

DESCRIPTION OF OTHER RIGHTS AND LIMITATIONS

Maintenance of Copyright Notices.

You must not remove or alter any copyright notices on any copy of SUBLIME TEXT.

Distribution.

You may not distribute or sell license keys or SUBLIME TEXT to third parties. Licenses will be revoked if distributed or sold to third parties.

Rental.

You may not rent, lease, or lend the license key or SUBLIME TEXT.


None.


So, can we agree that it is unreasonable to assume that developing and open sourcing a Package Addon for a popular ShareWare tool should obligate an an author to purchase a license for the software his work is targeting?


I think 8ig8 was the one saying that the licence does't really allow you to skip the $70. I think you have made the confusion between 8ig8 and whao.


i do not believe that i am confused. let me recap for you just in case

whao: who cares whether he paid, he contributed value

8gig8: i concede that he has contributed value, but maintain that the package author has violated the license

me: i disagree with your assertion that the author has violated the license, and place the burden of responsibility on you to substantiate your claims

8gig8: i will vaguely avoid substantiating my claim

me: at this point i will express the reasons why i disagreed with your claim and ask you whether you agree with them or not

8gig8: (crickets)


This is by design.

The more people that uses ST2, the more people that buys it.

Preventing people from using it will only make them look for and use an alternative.

You may call it 'DRM by guilt' if you wish.


$70 isn't a lot of money. Is it an hour of your time? Maybe two? If people don't want to pay that's fine, use one of the great open source editors. Saying you don't have the money doesn't make it ok to violate the license. rms works hard to give you emacs for free. The Sublime guys are trying to earn a living.


70 US Dollar equals 643.45 South African Rand.

To put that in perspective: R650 is a basic grocery shop for my small family for a week.

I have a day job, a baby under a year old, another kid reaching teenagerdom and a bootstrapped startup. My wife works part time.

I wish more startups and even more mature companies would build in some sort of currency sensitive sliding scale for their pricing models. I know what a ball ache pricing is and how much time we tend to spend on it already but I'd love to be able to support and often times the reality is that I simply cannot afford to... Because of the exchange rate.

I take issue with your suggestion that people like myself piss off and use OSS though and I take issue with it for one simple reason: I personally use the 'nag screen version' of Sublime. I'm crazy about the product and when I have a row of developers working on a product that's paying the bills then rest assured - I'll be buying those licenses. In the mean time people see me using it, I evangelize the app fairly regularly, etc.

I know the Sublime guys are trying to earn a living, we all are, and I think that having more users of any kind will ultimately lead to more users of the paying kind.


I know it's hard to implement and people will abuse it, but I always thought it would be nice if registration fees are per country or region, maybe scaled to the median income.

In that manner, more people could afford to buy a program and the developer could probably earn more income.

That said, I purchased Sublime Text, but I mostly use vim, because my brain is not wired for modeless editing :).


ST2 has vintage mode (modal). It's not perfect, but it's something.


What's wrong with using the OSS stuff? It's free and that's the price that you want to pay. If more people used the OSS stuff, and helped to improve it then we'd all be better off. By stealing paid software, you aren't helping anyone but yourself. Even simply using the software and asking questions helps to build up the knowledge base. e.g.

http://stackoverflow.com/tags/emacs

http://askubuntu.com/


Whoa! I don't remember saying that there is anything wrong with OSS products and I'm fairly certain that clicking 'Later' instead of 'Buy Now!' on Sublime Text's nag screen does not constitute stealing... Am I wrong here?


How many times do you have to click "Later" before it becomes "continued use?"

"Sublime Text may be downloaded and evaluated for free, however a license must be purchased for continued use."

http://www.sublimetext.com/buy

You could of course argue the finer points, but you know if you've passed the "evaluation stage."


My feeling is that the terms are deliberately open to definition.

The developers could quite easily have implemented a counter of some kind should they wish to implement a limit and I certainly would feel no ill will were they to do that at some stage.

I, for one, given my circumstances, am very glad they they have left it open as they have - had I 70$ to chuck at it, I certainly would. When I do, I will.


If they put a hard limit on "continued use", what would it achieve?

Probably a few more sales, but at the cost of forcing some current users to stop using their product (if they can't afford the full version yet), or waste time jumping through anti-DRM hoops -- I've known people who are constantly setting their computer clock back, or tinkering with the Windows registry, or... all kinds of silly things so they can keep using an expired trial version of some software.

If they can keep those users on the trial version (and earn some goodwill as well for their flexibility), eventually some of them will be in a better financial or mental situation (whichever variable needs to change!) and will pay the license fee.

If they start the user down the path of battling DRM, or being forced to stop using their software, in either case they're starting a conflict.

So it's a business (and human) decision; they want to stay on your side even if you are pushing their internal definition of "continued use".


People will always justify this sort of thing - hopefully your startup won't be abused in a similar manner.


Justify what sort of thing? Using the nag version, which is his full and total right? And being from a place of relative poorness, where the asking price is equivalent to $400 dollars?

Where exactly did you bought your moral high-standing? Was it cheap?


I had hoped to get across that I'm really not abusing the developers of this product. Please correct me if I have misunderstood but not converting to a full fledged customer from a Shareware customer (yet-dictated by circumstances) and with every intention of doing so as soon as I am generating income with the software ...does not a pirate make. Have I missed a beat here?


>$70 isn't a lot of money. Is it an hour of your time?

Spoken like a guy that hasn't discovered that the internet is global, and that $70 dollars can be your monthly salary (or very near it) in some places.


$70 is a months wage in many parts of the world.

Disclaimer: "World" in the above statement refers to parts of the earth map which are not occupied by North America and old Europe. ;)


For the record, I not only paid my $70, but I lost political capital with my manager for forcing her to purchase seats for all the other engineers on our team who saw how much happier I was because of it. I do not advocate abusing the considerable latitude that Jon Skinner has gifted us. But I do believe that he meant to be as generous as possible with the plausible ambiguity of the word "evaluation" as he uses in his license terms. the response to the FAQ seems to confirm that.


If it was clear that ST2 can make your team happier, then I would expect you to gain political capital for the purchase and not lose it!


You would hope so :(


It is in a country where a programmer makes $450/month.


No, the fact that licensing ideas is a bullshit scam is why it's ok to violate the license.

IP is an abstraction. We don't all subscribe to it.

Please do not take away from this comment that I don't think devs should get paid.


The license is asking you to pay to use the working code. It doesn't say anything about ideas.


How could one not?


People don't ascribe in anything that's "the law" or "established".

Take the US for example.

Slavery was the law back in the day.

Segregated buses, hotels, restaurants and housing areas for blacks and whites was also the law, just 50 years ago.

Death penalty is still the law today.


You don't have a fundamental right to his program. The rise of the Internet hippy is painful to watch.


Nope, you're right. But he also has no fundamental right to get paid for being the first to magnetize his hard drive in a certain configuration.


He absolutely does. If you make something, you have a fundamental right to decide how it gets used.


Some day I will buy it :) but I must know that when I bought it I would have all that I need %)


Seriously, add a donate button to that page! I'm almost paying you through gittip, but I prefer if you have a default option to it.


I added a donate button!


I'm surprised because if you have the ability to create something like this you'd think they'd be able to monetize those skills.

Having said that maybe he/she should be given a free license.


I will be glad %)


Thanks to @Raynos!!! He bought a license for me!


This is pretty damn cool, but I can't help but notice that the UI seems to be severely limited by Sublime's API.


This is why I tried creating my own simple "text editor" within my experimenta live IDE, so that I would not be limited by anyone's API or closed source and could create something more unusual.

Is it a better approach? It's really hard to say, and definitely not obvious. I had to re-create a lot of existing functionality just so that I could more easily modify it. And clearly I cannot compete with the advanced functionality of a dedicated modern text editor.

So far it hasn't led to me anything beyond what one could've probably achieved by hooking things up to an existing API, as demonstrated by this project (perhaps aside from live editing on a type-a-character level rather than on-save level), but I'm keeping my eyes open. Perhaps I'll get lucky and come up with something that wouldn't have been possible otherwise. That was my motivation.


>This is why I tried creating my own simple "text editor" within my experimenta live IDE, so that I would not be limited by anyone's API or closed source and could create something more unusual.

Which is self defeating. By not being limited by ST's (or anyone's) API, you are limited by your own capabilities and time. You now have to right the editor AND the extra stuff.

As such you have, what you say a "simple text editor".


Have you thought of building on top of a library like CodeMirror (which Light Table is built on)?'

edit: ST2 -> Light Table


I'm actually working on something like this for myself; In the future I hope to support sublime plugins. Entirely haml/coffee, built with node-webkit and ace-editor. Based off of TextDrive a chrome app.

Currently there is a more advanced editor (brackets). But I want total control of the stack. I'm tired of closed source editors (sublime), or overly complex c-based editors (textmate, vi, etc). I think it can be done just as well with web technologies. I also don't like remote editors (cloud9), I want it local.

Light Table takes an entirely difference approach. I'm just going for a simple editor, no-integrated-repl-thingie.


Where on earth did you read that ST2 is build on CodeMirror?


My mistake, I meant Light Table.


No because I work with native platforms (OS X, Linux, Windows) using C++/Go instead of a browser/JS. At least for the time being.


Yes, feels like reinventing the wheel. A way to set breakpoints on editor would suffice, really.


I just recently found that if you put

  debugger;
in JS, it will trigger a breakpoint. Very handy


It looks like a great start. I don't think it will yet pull me away from a dual monitor with ST2 + Chrome Inspector + Live Reload, but if it is further polished I think it could.


Note that this is more then reloading the web-page. It actually seems to be doing hot code-replacement on the fly. I only know this from Java in the debug mode or JRebel. Having this work for Javascript will be really neat... I am feeling more and more confident that my move away from Webstorm to ST2 was the right one...


Like I said, it's a great start, but Chrome Inspector still does a lot more (right now), and I'm more apt to stay there -- but this is inspiring, and if it gets closer to feature parity with C.I. -- well it will be a no-brainer then, and I'd happily pay for it, too.


Live Reload appears to be OSX only, and this looks much more simple to setup than Guard-livereload.


There are many different incarnations of "live reload"; it is definitely not OSX only. The concept is simple - refresh the front-end / back-end when and edit or save occurs.


I use sublime 2 + live reload on linux all the time


Live Reload?


http://livereload.com/

I'm presuming you're lazy to use Google or don't know what Live Reload is because you have not articulated your question very well.


I didn't ask you.


Huh? There's no need to be a dick. Chill out.


kaichanvong's response wasn't the most appropriate either.


Fair comment. I apologise for that.

The point still stands that I don't understand what he was asking :)


Just the other day, I spent a good couple hours looking for good Linux web development tools. Something that mocked Brackets - this is exactly that. Only thing missing is a quick edit CSS feature, that would drop down the styling for a selected tag.


This is incredible. I was particularly happy when I noticed Chrome filepaths for Mac, Linux, and Windows - some of the more powerful Sublime plugins (looking at you, LiveReload and that really powerful Markdown plugin) were developed by Mac guys who didn't bother porting them to Windows.

Not that I'm angry at the aforementioned Mac guys (it's not like they're getting paid to make me free stuff) but it's nice to see someone go the extra mile.


The linux path is the same as the Mac one, which is pretty lol. It's /usr/bin/google-chrome on most systems I think.


Looks like a very cool tool. Live reload alone should speed up development quite a bit, or at least remove some of the annoying wait between changing code and seeing the result.

Unrelated: Ah, Sublime Linter, you are always making ST unresponsible. Clicking away the message has almost become part of my workflow. I should probably just disable the warning, though.


The good stuff starts around 3:20.


Thanks, came here looking for this.

I know some people are camera shy on the web, but it would be nice if the video was zoomed to the mouse or cursor just so we could actually make out what was going on.


I think this is brilliant. This could change the way I work. Great work, thanks!


This looks rather nifty, anyone know if there's anything comparable for Emacs?


Kite, though it's not ready for production yet:

https://github.com/jscheid/kite


I hope this also works for Chrome Remote debugging

https://developers.google.com/chrome-developer-tools/docs/re...


I've been wanting such a feature for many years. SB2 is turning out into next big editor. I wonder when will they put command line navigation like ViM and Emacs into it.


Sublime Text 2 has been really slow for me on Ubuntu for a few months. I haven't been able to fix it or even google anything about it. So sad.


I was hoping for ST3 support, but since the author is running ST2 Unregistered, that's not going to happen soon. Oh well.


Yap :) just donate me some bucks for my work. I will buy ST3 when it will be released.


You could just donate him a licence.


This is pretty nice, but the live reload package and existing browser debugging tools appear to still be more productive.


I'm totally fine with debugging on browser, with live edits, I don't see a need for sublime text inspector.


agreed




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